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Tony
05 Jun 12, 16:20
Dealing with Negative environments.

This is a huge subject, and entails the whole of life, one's beliefs, one's view.
We do live in a negative environment...of our minds! Saying 'we' means all of us: this is quite a shock when you consider it! This planet is lovely, but it is inhabited by sentient beings who cling to ideas about themselves and everyone else.
This clinging is a not-knowing of our true nature, and could be called negative.
Resting in our true nature would then be seen as positive, but we do not notice this nature and so we live in a negative world! Oh, we can put on a brave face, and make things seem better, but these are only temporary fixes.

It's starting to sound scary, isn't it? Well, it needn't!

First we have to look at a touchy area...our beliefs. Now comes a really touchy area: what we believe may only be a partial system that is incomplete. Everyone's journey is different, but step by step we progress...get stuck...get emotional...resolve...progress...

So we go through stages of dissatisfaction...satisfaction...dissatisfaction.. .rough...smooth...

The individual temperament will dictate how fast we go through all this. If we adopt a system that is incomplete, there will be gaps in how to deal with everything.

If we say, “Well I'm self taught,” that is not altogether true, unless we have been in an isolated cave all our lives without contact with anyone! If we have senses and a mind, and have had contact with others, we will have been influenced. But this information may be incomplete, and as a result of that, any trauma that occurs will overtake us.

At this point, we come back to the subtle information body where feelings are stored. We can start to see how our lives are controlled by mistaken information – and this is maintained by everyone else around us. This situation is not helped by the corporate world!

We are bombarded by advertising about living the perfect dream, so naturally we will feel dissatisfied because life is just not like that. But somewhere, deep inside our minds, we think it should be. As a result of this constant disappointment, many people become more negative than normal. If one listens to (or reads) some people's patterning, it will all sound negative: they can't help having a go!

The type of negativity that arise most commonly in me is perceiving a pointlessness in everything.
I go...“What's the point?!”
This brings us back to the value of having a complete system. It's not so much dealing with other people's emotions - it's dealing with our own emotions and reactions: all systems offer plenty of antidotes to counteract our negative emotions (the only way to counteract someone else's negative emotions is to give them space, by not reacting).

The simplest answer IS love - un-conditional love. Now that is a tall order!
We begin with love for ourselves.
Not with criticism or blame or guilt or fear of our reactions. None of these are us.
Most of the time we fear our own reactions, and so we set up a barrier of defence around ourselves. We expect ourselves to be better. We want to be better at all sorts of things, but life is pretty short, so it is easy to feel a failure isn't it?

Much of the information in our heads is put there, and has nothing to do with our true being. We have to discern what is useful and what is not. The point of meditation is to separate ourself from those thoughts. Once that has been done, we are in awareness. This awareness looks in o itself and finds...nothing - pure awareness. It is empty and has a knowing quality...Pure Essence.

OK, so now we come to the good bit!
Pure Essence is a dry awareness.
Its expression is the juice...Pure Love. A Pure Heart!

Because we are not enlightened, emotions will still arise, even though we have had a glimpse of this Essence Love. This is because our awareness of essence has dimmed or gone unnoticed, and we are attached again to the feeling of “I”, and our mental image of self.

Once we have this glimpse of Essence, any emotion that arises is seem as a temporary event of an “I” identification and has absolutely no reality. The emotions are now the teacher, showing us that we have moved away from Essence.

Knowing Essence is very simple, and will be recognised through practice or through having it pointed out at the right time. It is slightly different from
just being aware. It doesn't matter if one isn't totally certain about Essence. It is just there.
Without it, we would not exist, but equally, we cannot say it exists.
I once saw a child fall over, and my impulse was to rush over to help...that was Essence Love.
However, the thought came in, “It's not my child, so I shouldn't interfere,” and I noticed that everyone else reacted the same way. I'd moved from essence to “I”.

That is the negative environment.

Even though there maybe things going on in the world, these are merely temporary external events. We shouldn't believe everything we read on forums like this!
We have to be aware of fear mongering and false promises of hope with the calvary coming.
These are subjects for comics...and they are both causes and products of a negative environment.

This negative environment is our teacher, if we can see it as such. It never truly existed in the first place: it may feel real, but it is not true.
If we can't see it as our teacher, we can just be kind to ourself, as this all takes time to digest.

Genuine Love is like a virus...it's catching!

One very last thing, we all want to make things better, to right all wrongs, to have peace in the family. It's not necessarily going to happen, in this incarnation. People need time and space, and there is a lot of time and a lot of space. In their own time they will come round to where they want to go, all we can do is not leave obstacles in the way.


Kind regards,
Tony

Aloka
05 Jun 12, 16:35
Dear Tony,

Thanks for sharing.. but that was a very long post to read in one posting box and reads like a lot of personal thoughts/statements in a blog. ( there's no provision for blogging at BWB)

Can you state briefly what it is in particular that you would like to discuss/debate for a topic with the rest of the group, please, because I'm not at all clear about that, and we are primarily a website for interactive discussions.

Personally I just try to accept whatever exterior environment I'm in and then act spontaneously according to my practice and understanding at that time.

As far as mental activity is concerned, my opinion is that studying the core teachings of Buddha together with regular samatha meditation and the practice of mindfulness can help to start lessening reactive emotions and a lot of unnecessary mental proliferation.


Kind regards

Aloka :hands:

Tony
05 Jun 12, 17:31
Dear Aloka,

I write on other sites, and someone asked about dealing with negativity.
This was just a reply, and thought it might help here.

Not everyone knows how to deal with negativity, even Buddhists.

Tony

Aloka
05 Jun 12, 20:55
Not everyone knows how to deal with negativity, even Buddhists.



This might possibly be helpful:






ACCEPTING THE WAY THINGS ARE

by Ajahn Sumedho


How many of you have been practising today trying to become something 'I have got to do this ... or become that ... or get rid of something ... or got to do something...' That compulsiveness takes over, even in our practice of Dhamma. 'This is the way it is' isn't a fatalistic attitude of not caring or being indifferent, but is a real openness to the way things have to be at this moment. For example, right now at this moment this is the way it is and it can't be any other way at this moment. It's so obvious, isn't it?

Right now, no matter whether you are feeling high or low or indifferent, happy or depressed, enlightened or totally deluded, half-enlightened, half-deluded, three-quarters deluded, one-quarter enlightened, hopeful or despairing - this is the way it is. And it can't be any other way at this moment.

How does your body feel? Just notice that the body is this way. It's heavy, it's earthbound, it's coarse, it gets hungry, it feels heat and cold, it gets sick, sometimes it feels very nice, sometimes it feels very horrible. This is the way it is. Human bodies are like this; so that this tendency to want it to be otherwise falls away. It doesn't mean we can't try to make things better, but we do so from understanding and wisdom rather than from an ignorant desire.

The world is this way and things happen, and it snows and the sun comes out, and people come and go, people have misunderstandings, people's feelings get hurt. People get lazy, and inspired and people get depressed and disillusioned, people gossip and disappoint each other and there is adultery and there's theft, drunkenness and drug addiction and there are wars, and there always have been.




Continued at link :


http://www.amaravati.org/documents/the_way_it_is/10atw.html





:hands:

The Thinker
06 Jun 12, 07:46
I am so agree with the words of Ajahn Sumedho. I also belief that if you let past being past and future being future and live in this moment, the stress and suffering of life will be more easy to handle.

Tony
06 Jun 12, 08:54
Ok, my question would be:
Why do buddhists hide behind a plethora of terminology and ritual when it comes to ordinary people's problems, like dealing with negativity?

I have observed three types of practitioners:
The religious = love rituals.
The philosophers = love dictionaries.
The experiencials = love moments....(there aren't many of those.)

At retreats none of these three types can talk to one another - we nod, smile and move on.
If I talk about a problem in the world, most buddhists say, “I do my practice, and I'm alright” or “all is as it is” or words to that effect. In other words, ignore someone else's problem!

Sometimes it feels like the medicine has become the disease.

This actually brings us to the different attitudes or vehicles to deal with the so-called negative emotions. For those that do not know the allegory, there is a bush with poison berries on it, this represents the negative emotions.

Hinayana, will not go near it. They cut any association with it, but it will always return.
Mahayana, will put a fence around it. They antidotes, but this is still a temporary fix.
Vajrayana, will see it as medicine. They will see poisons as wisdom.
Dzogchen/Mahamudra, will know that the poison never existed in the first place.

Here is the twist – Some who think themselves Dzogchen/Mahamudra practitioner are actually Hinayana. Like wise some Hinayana have a Dzogchen/Mahamudra attitude.

It does not matter what people say, it is how they react that reveals all. All I'm saying is do not let anyone pull the wool over your eyes, don't forget to be a decent compassionate human being.

I apologise for the use of any terminology that might confuse, no Dharma practitioner was hurt in this presentation!:up2:


Tony

Aloka
06 Jun 12, 09:05
Hinayana.....Hinayana ....



Hi Tony, just as an aside - as you are a Tibetan Buddhist practitioner, I wonder if you are aware that 'Hinayana' can be used as a pejorative term to describe Theravada, which is why we try to avoid its use here (except perhaps jokingly).





The myth of Hinayana

In the centuries around the birth of Christ there was a radical development going on in Buddhism. A new school was born, and its adherents called it Mahayana. How this new school differed from the earlier schools, can be found in any history of Buddhism. Here we will concentrate on one of the results of this schism: the term Hinayana.

The adherents of the older schools criticized the Mahayanists, especially for creating new sutras, forging the word of the Buddha. The Mahayanists on the other side reacted to that critique by accusing their opponents of not understanding the teaching of the Buddha at all and for beeing narrowminded egoists. The debate got heated, and accusations flowed from both sides. Then some brilliant person at the Mahayana side of the debate created the word pair Mahayana/Hinayana, and it stuck. They called their opponents Hinayana, and this word worked excellently as an insult – with a simplicity and a parallellity to Mahayana that any fool could grasp.


continued:

http://www.lienet.no/hinayan1.htm





kind regards

Aloka

The Thinker
06 Jun 12, 09:07
I think most Buddhist are understanding and nice people :) I can only speak for my self but in my practise as a Buddhist its the attachments i try to get rid of, and someone who dont know we can sometimes call me cold because i dont show to much emotions, but inside me i have a lot of emotions. When it come to the negative side of life, as a Buddhist i see negativity as a karmic reaction to something that has happen in life, and from that view i need to understand what i did wrong before to get in to that negative situation. everything in life happens for a reason :)

The thinker

Goofaholix
06 Jun 12, 09:24
I have observed three types of practitioners:
The religious = love rituals.
The philosophers = love dictionaries.
The experiencials = love moments....(there aren't many of those.)

If all these types of practitioners are wrong what in your view would be the characteristics of the right kind of practitioner?

Tony
06 Jun 12, 09:36
If all these types of practitioners are wrong what in your view would be the characteristics of the right kind of practitioner?

They are not wrong, just different temperaments. 'Right' would probably all three combined. So, discipline, proper understanding, but above seeing our reactions as our teacher.

Tony
06 Jun 12, 09:48
We create our world, our reactions maintains it. How we deal with this is an individual issue, based on what we find as satisfying.
Here we have every right to change, as the path to enlightenment is a refining of perception. At every level perception changes.
So it is a constant letting go. However learning is painful, but we learn.

Ego is merely a word given to the action of consciousness, clinging. Until enlightenment there will be ego of some sort.

Tony

Tony
06 Jun 12, 09:50
Hi Tony, just as an aside - as you are a Tibetan Buddhist practitioner, I wonder if you are aware that 'Hinayana' can be used as a pejorative term to describe Theravada, which is why we try to avoid its use here (except perhaps jokingly).





kind regards

Aloka


It is important to never forget Hinayana practice. It should be included in advanced practices.

The Thinker
06 Jun 12, 10:05
I my self are an Theravada Buddhist and no matter what other call the way i follow, i cant let that be a problem for me :) if someone want to joke about it i will just smile back to them :))

" If someone treat you bad, then smile to them and think, you just made my day better "

Aloka
06 Jun 12, 10:25
It is important to never forget Hinayana practice. It should be included in advanced practices.

More about the term 'Hinayana'




The word Hīnayāna is formed of hīna (हीन): "poor", "inferior","abandoned", "deficient", "defective;" and yāna (यान): "vehicle", where "vehicle" means "a way of going to enlightenment". The Pali Text Society's Pali-English Dictionary (1921–25) defines hīna in even stronger terms, with a semantic field that includes "poor, miserable; vile, base, abject, contemptible," and "despicable."

In the Chinese, Korean, Vietnamese and Japanese languages, the term was translated by Kumārajīva and others as "small vehicle" (小 meaning "small", 乘 meaning "vehicle"), although earlier and more accurate translations of the term also exist. In Mongolian (Baga Holgon) term for Hinayana also means "small" or "lesser" vehicle,while in Tibetan there are at least two words to designate the term, theg chung (Tibetan: ཐེག་ཆུང་) meaning "small vehicle", and theg dman (Tibetan: ཐེག་དམན་) meaning "inferior vehicle" or "inferior spiritual approach".


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hinayana#Etymology



Hi Tony

There are a range of meanings with an extremely negative connotation and so the use of that word isn't an appropriate one to describe practices and teachings in a mixed tradition group such as this one.

I am a former Vajrayana practitioner myself and am very much aware of what it implies, so lets not use it, please, or even perhaps assume that one tradition has more advanced practices than another just because it says so. ;)

Thanks

:hands:

Tony
06 Jun 12, 10:40
I my self are an Theravada Buddhist and no matter what other call the way i follow, i cant let that be a problem for me :) if someone want to joke about it i will just smile back to them :))

" If someone treat you bad, then smile to them and think, you just made my day better "

Confidence in one's path is so important. We are beyond names. Good for you!

The Thinker
06 Jun 12, 10:44
Thank you for the kind words Tony :)

The thinker

Tony
06 Jun 12, 10:48
More about the term 'Hinayana'



Hi Tony

There are a range of meanings with an extremely negative connotation and so the use of that word isn't an appropriate one to describe practices and teachings in a mixed tradition group such as this one.

I am a former Vajrayana practitioner myself and am very much aware of what it implies, so lets not use it, please, or assume that one tradition has more 'advanced' practices than another just because it says so.

Thanks

:hands:

Okidoki! I always saw it as discipline, though a little rigid.
We all have to good through some sort of boot camp!:up2:

I don't mind what I'm called...though I like good friend best!:hug:

Aloka
06 Jun 12, 10:51
I don't mind what I'm called...though I like good friend best!:hug:

.

Yes indeed, and its very nice when we can all be good friends here. :hands:

Tony
08 Jun 12, 10:12
Are the negative emotions enemies or friends?

This will depend on your point of view. Note, your point of view, not someone else telling you, your point of view. If we are told to view the poisons as enemies you will see them as enemies. If we are told to view the poisons as wisdoms, we will see them as wisdoms.

They are both! From one point of view they are obscuration to realising Essence. From another point of view, they are a reminder of Essence.

Sometimes the teachings have to be adapted to suit the western mind. Westerns are very alert and conscious, tell them to be more conscious will make them go round the bend! That is suitable for easterners who do not have so much emotional problems but may be more sleepy.

We have emotional problems. And have to be dealt with in a different way.

It's like talking about EGO as if it's a sin, this is a control mechanism, to create guilt. Ego is merely a word for consciousness holding onto concepts. Gently being aware of this loosens the grip. Making a big deal out of it, only makes it seem more real, when it's not real at all.

There will be some sort of ego until enlightenment. What is compassion or love but expression essence, there is a little ego there. Isn't it wonderful!

We must never forget human warmth.

Kind regards,
Tony

Tony
08 Jun 12, 10:35
Teachings can be confusing.

When I go on retreat, which is in silence, people seem to become Zombies. I had to put a notice up saying, “ You are not zombies, being silent does not mean don't smile!” The only people that were normal, were the dinner ladies who fed us!

Remember we are free spirits.

Goofaholix
08 Jun 12, 20:09
Are the negative emotions enemies or friends?

They are a combination of physical sensations in the body and thought processes in the mind.

Not reacting with aversion to negative emotion and seeing into their impermanent, unsatisfactory, and not self nature diffuses their ability to get a hold over us.

Trying to deal with negative emotion on the level of the storyline only feeds it in my experience.

Tony
09 Jun 12, 11:39
If all these types of practitioners are wrong what in your view would be the characteristics of the right kind of practitioner?

Well, they are sentient! So will mistaken until enlightenment.

Tony
09 Jun 12, 11:47
They are a combination of physical sensations in the body and thought processes in the mind.

Not reacting with aversion to negative emotion and seeing into their impermanent, unsatisfactory, and not self nature diffuses their ability to get a hold over us.

Trying to deal with negative emotion on the level of the storyline only feeds it in my experience.

What you say is so interesting. In trying to answer the above question will depend on which tradition we follow.

In my chosen path, the negative emotions never existed in the first place. But when they do arise due to a dullness of Essence, and a down grading of consciousness to a mental "I", the emotion with such a vivid appearance reminds one of one true nature.

So negative emotions appearance is a wisdom. One of five!

Goofaholix
09 Jun 12, 19:52
So negative emotions appearance is a wisdom. One of five!

This makes no sense, so the angriest and most depressed people in the world are the wisest?

Negative emotion arises due to past causes and conditions, there's nothing we can do about that except to avoid the causes and conditions that gave rise to them and so lessen the possibility they will continue to arise in future.

In the meantime while experiencing the negative emotion that has already arisen how one reacts to is where the rubber hits the road as far as wisdom is concerned. Instead of adding to it through increased reactivity and making it snowball observing it with clarity and equanimity understanding it's impermanent, unsatisfactory, and not self nature leads to it running out of steam. This is wisdom.

Tony
10 Jun 12, 08:55
This makes no sense, so the angriest and most depressed people in the world are the wisest?

Negative emotion arises due to past causes and conditions, there's nothing we can do about that except to avoid the causes and conditions that gave rise to them and so lessen the possibility they will continue to arise in future.

In the meantime while experiencing the negative emotion that has already arisen how one reacts to is where the rubber hits the road as far as wisdom is concerned. Instead of adding to it through increased reactivity and making it snowball observing it with clarity and equanimity understanding it's impermanent, unsatisfactory, and not self nature leads to it running out of steam. This is wisdom.

What you say is very important, and it reveals the differences between the traditions and teachings.

The five wisdoms are the five Buddha families, each of which has a corresponding neurotic tendencies. If one's essence is recognised, then when a negative emotion arises, it is immediately seen as one of the wisdoms: therefore, we are beginning to look at the unity of the two truths, relative and absolute. I could go into more detail if you wish.

All the best
Tony

Aloka
10 Jun 12, 09:17
The five wisdoms are the five Buddha families, each of which has a corresponding neurotic tendencies. If one's essence is recognised, then when a negative emotion arises, it is immediately seen as one of the wisdoms: therefore, we are beginning to look at the unity of the two truths, relative and absolute. I could go into more detail if you wish.


Hi Tony,

I was a Tibetan Buddhist practitioner for a long time before deciding to change to Theravada.

I am familiar with the concept of the 5 Buddha Families and their corresponding emotions and wisdoms. However, in your ordinary daily life , can you honestly say that these concepts enable you, for example, to immediately deal with the arising of anger in a disagreement with someone?

Please give a detailed example of how you are able to effectively deal with this and other negative emotions on an everyday level.

kind regards

Aloka ;D

Goofaholix
10 Jun 12, 09:23
The five wisdoms are the five Buddha families, each of which has a corresponding neurotic tendencies. If one's essence is recognised, then when a negative emotion arises, it is immediately seen as one of the wisdoms: therefore, we are beginning to look at the unity of the two truths, relative and absolute. I could go into more detail if you wish.


Not really, looking at wikipedia though the 5 wisdoms doesn't appear to have anything to do with negative emotion http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_wisdoms

Aloka
10 Jun 12, 09:31
Not really, looking at wikipedia though the 5 wisdoms doesn't appear to have anything to do with negative emotion http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_wisdoms

There's a detailed and correct explanation here:

http://www.rinpoche.com/teachings/5families.pdf

I can't post an excerpt because there are specific copyright restrictions .

Tony
10 Jun 12, 10:46
Not really, looking at wikipedia though the 5 wisdoms doesn't appear to have anything to do with negative emotion http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_wisdoms


Hello Goofaholix,

You will definitely not find this information in wikipedia! This is Dzogchen. If you want to talk, we can talk.

Tony
10 Jun 12, 10:55
Hi Tony,

I was a Tibetan Buddhist practitioner for a long time before deciding to change to Theravada.

I am familiar with the concept of the 5 Buddha Families and their corresponding emotions and wisdoms. However, in your ordinary daily life , can you honestly say that these concepts enable you, for example, to immediately deal with the arising of anger in a disagreement with someone?

Please give a detailed example of how you are able to effectively deal with this and other negative emotions on an everyday level.

kind regards

Aloka ;D

Good morning Aloka,

This is a gradual process of understanding. It happen quite naturally, one find that the emotion arises but subsides. There are three illustrations of this: A knot in a snake (uncoils itself), writing on water, and a thief entering a empty house.

This brings us to the four types of teacher: root, lineage, inner and symbolic. The symbolic teacher being everything that arises.

I wrote a short article this morning called 'Trigger happy', it may help.

Trigger happy!
In all of our encounters with others, a trigger can occur. It's not quite a reaction, but it triggers something in the mind. It inspires! It joins up some dots! Now depending on one's attitude and understanding, this may happen sometimes or be quite frequent. Another word for this is 'learning'.

This is why we need one another, to bounce ideas off. It's not so much the ideas, but it may show a fresh approach. That's if a big fat ego of pride isn't in the way!

If we actually want to learn about ourselves, then these triggers are the best things ever. Anything that expands our view must be of benefit. Of course there could be a slight discomfort as one has to let go of a previous approach, or maybe it can be seen as an upgrade.

If we merely argue about something we see as untrue, we are only giving that untruth...legs!..which it does not deserve.

Every encounter is an opportunity. One day you may realise, “Hey I don't react anymore!” That will make you happy. Hm..”I can turn this into a positive event.”

Be trigger happy!


Tony

Aloka
10 Jun 12, 11:48
Hi Tony,

You still havent explained how you yourself deal directly with a negative emotion when it arises.

Tony
10 Jun 12, 15:29
A quick answer: the arising of an emotion brightens up the mind suddenly. At that moment, one has a choice of whether to go in, or go out. Going in would be to refresh the connection with essence – that creates space so that one doesn't just react. Because of that space, one can then respond as necessary. But one is not reacting from a negative emotion in this scenario. Depending on the situation, one would use one of the enlightened activities (even though one isn't enlightened!) of pacifying, magnetising, enriching and destroying, whilst being mindful that inner demons of like and dislike are lying in ambush...we are constantly being tested, and this is to be welcomed.

A longer answer: a couple of years ago, on a month-long silent retreat, I was having a real problem with yidam practice. Suddenly, I saw that there was a connection between the kayas and the so-called poisons. This brought me to an understanding of the unity of the two truths of reality and a seeming reality. This in turn brought me to a greater understanding of the symbolic teacher – that the whole of samsara is a teacher (and not an enemy). And that anything we need to learn is in our own reactions. I told my teacher this, and he gave me a huge hug.

I know this may sound like a cliché, but it is how it works. It's a gradual process, but suddenly you find that you're not reacting the way that you used to, and a sense of responsibility dawns – that others are more important than oneself.

All my questions have been answered: there are now only subtle ones about whether and how to engage with others, and for that, one needs to review one's intentions. Of course, there is still ego there, but it is more or less tamed (I know saying this makes me an easy target to attack, but I am no longer going to feel guilty about ego any more...Buddhists do tend to use that as an weapon against one another!)

With the discovery of non-meditation in meditation, this brings us to conduct in daily life. This is just a continuity of the view. When something comes up that distracts – such as somebody else's emotions – it is noted but not reacted upon. Emotions do still arise, but they are radiantly sharp and offer an opportunity to look into their nature. As one gets older, one is less involved in trivia. I do find a lot of the Buddhist teachings hold people down with dogma, when we are actually free spirits!

One important point I have learned is about inner wind in the subtle body. In the modern world, we have become very speedy people and this raises the inner wind from below the navel, into the upper body which causes tensions and a sense of anxiety. This merely entails using the gentle vase breath to bring the inner wind down again. I can explain more about this later.

One more important point...and this is very important! There are beings in this world who know all the teachings of the Buddha, but don't practise. They are called Mara. Much of the strife in the world is created by them, and this in turn puts additional pressure on people. If you want, it is exemplified by the corporate world feeding on the ego-clinging of people, and this is something that I have found it difficult to get the lamas to understand.

In fact, our minds are full of negativity, as everything is based on a mental image of “I”. Understanding this, one can be kinder to people and not see them as “wrong”...just mistaken. I told my teacher that I have empathy for negative people and compassion for positive people (they hide their wounds well): he agreed.

I suppose at some time in one's Dharma life, one has to take the teachings to heart and give up all the books and theories and rules and see how it really does feel. It is most important not to forget ordinary human warmth.

So the negative emotions are not bad, unless they are acted out.

All the best
Tony

Aloka
10 Jun 12, 19:28
A quick answer....

Lol, Tony, it looks like a really long answer to me ! I thought you said you were a Dzogchen practitioner?

If you notice an emotion arising and just relax into it completely, it dissolves....poot !

No need for excessive analysis and labelling ;)

Which Nyingma organisation do you practice with ? Rigpa?

Goofaholix
10 Jun 12, 19:50
If you notice an emotion arising and just relax into it completely, it dissolves....poot !

No need for excessive analysis and labelling ;)

Thanks for the translation.

If that's the gist of it then he's pretty much been saying the same thing I've been saying only in a more long winded fashion.

Tony
11 Jun 12, 06:42
Thanks for the translation.

If that's the gist of it then he's pretty much been saying the same thing I've been saying only in a more long winded fashion.

Long winded, surely not, just comprehensive!

Tony
11 Jun 12, 07:03
Lol, Tony, it looks like a really long answer to me ! I thought you said you were a Dzogchen practitioner?

If you notice an emotion arising and just relax into it completely, it dissolves....poot !

No need for excessive analysis and labelling ;)

Which Nyingma organisation do you practice with ? Rigpa?

No need for analysis? Analytical meditation is part of practice in my tradition, I love it! It's a bit like being a spiritual engineer, noticing the slight changes in attitude and view. Knowing the different between the eight consciousness (alaya) and rigpa. Relaxing into an emotion does do it for my, knowing the wisdom quality does! Hey, each to their own!

We can practice to feel better, but that can become a little sticky! Dzogchen is just an simple view, quite ordinary. Talking about it can take many words. I go on several retreats a year one is intensive in Colorado, a month long. The lama talks, and talks and talks, we take a topic apart. It is not at all a waste of time.

We all go to what satisfies us, and it may be slightly different to one another. There is no right or wrong. On the path to enlightenment perception changes, at each level the same words are used but the experience is different.

Sogyal Rinpoche is not my teacher, but is excellent.

All the best,
Tony

Tony
12 Jun 12, 09:41
An illustration of the outer teacher, inner teacher and the emotions working together.

This is probably the most difficult article I have ever written, because it entails many elements. It will show how nothing is perfect, and, everything is perfect.

I write on several forums ( just experimenting) and quite often an individual will come up, who holds a very strong view. This one was about there is no need for a teacher, path or practice.
A common theme from the new age sector, and they have every right to their view.

This is not about them, but my reaction. I'd like to know if others have experienced something similar.

There had been a long discussion spanning a few weeks, and it was a little frustrating, because there was no discussion, just repetition of set phrases. After the last session, I just blew my top! I felt totally useless, and it all seemed pointless. I just could not work out what had gone wrong, as I felt that I couldn't help anyone.

During meditation this morning, this was my overall feeling, and it seemed to get worse and worse. In fact I noticed that it was speeding up (or out of control!) Suddenly the word 'speed' rang out! Now this may get complicated, but I'll try to keep sane!

The word 'speed' had a great significance. This is to do with the subtle body, it's where our residue of feelings are held. I wouldn't have known this unless my teacher had explained it to me. What happens is that an external event occurs and because of past experiences the inner wind rises and one might feel anxious or anger or fear or some sort of tension in the body.

So because of the weeks of frustration, a reaction had occurred in my subtle body, this was aversion, which in this case was subtle fear. Fear of not being able to deal with the situation, so fear of my own mind!

This emotion was very bright and clear, it had an energy in it. If one knows the nature of emotions then they can either stay demonic or seen as wisdom. I know this because my teacher explained it to me. In Tibetan buddhism there is a diagram of the 'wheel of life', part of it has the twelve links of cyclic life, each depending on the other for our habitual patterning to take place.

At number seven is a fellow with an arrow in his eye, this represents 'contact'. It is the moment when past karma ripens, and if we just react, we merely continue in our habit, making a deeper and deeper groove! However if we are able to not 'react', to find a gap in our reactions, we experience the freedom of space, and no karma is produced. I know this because my teacher explained it to me.

So, our inner teacher is Essence. This was introduced to me by my own practice, and verified by my teacher. Having realised my true Essence ( a baby realisation!) I was able to see that the whole of phenomena was now my teacher, ie karmically produced situations. Which on every occasion is an opportunity to negate karmic effects, instead of acting in a repeated pattern.

To keep this short, the outcome of all this is...noticing! It is not a eureka moment, it is a gradual understanding. The same things will arise in the future, but will be recognise or noted more easily.
This is part of the process, if one chooses to work that way.

There are two parts to our enlightened journey, one is realising our true Essence.
The other is exhausting our reactions (karma).

Sometimes we hear the phrase, “It resonates with me”.We have to be sure what this is. This could either be a true connection with our inner teacher, or just familiar feelings in this subtle body.

It has to be noted that our emotional reactions can drive us into a 'rage of righteousness' which we may find we enjoy...for the moment! This is up to you if this is the way you want to live. But it does not solve the problem, it creates the next one!

So one can see how nothing is perfect, because obstacles always arise. But everything can be seen as perfect as it all fits together, therefore can be taken apart! What notices all this, it's our knowing quality, our nature is to Know.

Whatever method works for you, works. If it does work, use it. The outcome will be loving kindness, and that is exactly what the world needs now, as long as we know what is going on, in our minds!



Tony

Ngagpa
17 Jun 12, 10:49
I really like that Tony, I think some of the terminology can be a little misleading for those who are not au fait with the Vajrayana.
But I thought it was an honest and interesting piece.

Thank you:hands:

BeTheChange
18 Jun 12, 12:47
I thoroughly enjoyed your post(s), Tony. There is much I relate to. Thank you for sharing. :peace: