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Aloka
17 Apr 10, 09:34
I'm curious to know what your thoughts are, as practising Buddhists, on the subject of trust .

What does it mean to you in its application to yourself... and in your interactions with other people?

Have you also encountered others who lie a lot - and how do you cope with that ? Do you find it difficult to trust them again - or not ?

plwk
17 Apr 10, 14:28
If I don't even trust myself, how can I trust others?
As far as I have known, trust is earned, goes both ways and not demanded from...even though from experience, it's been demanded from me...
Giving the benefit of the doubt....its a level of struggle that I have to learn from...

thundreams
17 Apr 10, 20:05
I also agree that trust has to be earned. I try to stay away from people who are habitual liers as it is easy to be caught in anothers web of deceit. This doesn't mean I would not help them if needed or have unconditional love for them. I just would not trust them; there would be certain personal boundries.

I have also caught myself aggreeing with people or evading the truth because it was easier. Something I have been working on.

http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/images/smilies/hands.gif

Pink_trike
17 Apr 10, 20:26
Trust is a story...a concretized belief in a uniquely crafted and comforting narrative - an exercise in grasping and aversion. Trust is just more religion, and a distraction from just.what.really.is.now. It is the unwillingness to rest in "I don't know", the source of all clarity.

Esho
18 Apr 10, 00:14
It is the unwillingness to rest in "I don't know", the source of all clarity.

http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/images/smilies/hands.gif

frank
18 Apr 10, 02:48
In the world of relationships trust is paramount,without trust there is no relationship worth having. On a mundane level yes trust has to be earned,but at another level trust is a form of crippling devise,it ties us to the world and therefore weakens us.

gerrymob
18 Apr 10, 09:55
I have always understood as a practising Buddhist that I should trust others without question. If I do not trust immediately I am making a judgement of that person and who am I to make judgements on any other human being. Am I without failings? I am of the opinion that there is inherent good in all people and that human nature will prevail and that we treat each other as equals. If the relationship breaks down because of the other party I will try point out what has happened but if we cannot be reconciled I shall move on, no crticisms, no bad feelings, I would hope that the other person may think of what actions brought the relationship to an end.

Peace

Gerry

frank
18 Apr 10, 10:12
I have always understood as a practising Buddhist that I should trust others without question.

Gerry, maybe you have read the postings that refer to "idiot compassion".
While your view is very commendable,(imo) idiot compassion extends to trusting everyone. Sorry.

Aloka
18 Apr 10, 10:20
Just so Gerry understands a little better, ' idiot compassion' was a term used by the late Chogyam Trungpa to describe the way we can mistakenly think we are practising compassion in certain circumstances where we are just enabling the ill will of others.

gerrymob
18 Apr 10, 10:22
from post #8

So where does that leave you?

Should I be going around looking for the worst in everyone I come into contact with?

Who am I to say who is an idiot or not?

Peace

Gerry

Aloka
18 Apr 10, 10:38
So where does that leave you?

Should I be going around looking for the worst in everyone I come into contact with?

Who am I to say who is an idiot or not

It doesn't mean it like that, Gerry. Have a look here ....


http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/index.php?action=vthread&foru m=2&topic=863&page=0 (http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/index.php?action=vthread&forum=2&topic=863&page=0)


Another example would be a woman constantly beaten by a partner who should walk away and say 'enough' rather than staying and being beaten again through practising mistaken compassion. The compassionate response for someone like that is to show (without violence or quarrels) that its not acceptable to be beaten up like that.

gerrymob
18 Apr 10, 10:58
from post #11

Dazzle

I can see your point of view about not walking away in the example thay you have given but I have found over many years that with all the discussions and showing by example how we should conduct ourselves that it is not always possible to make people change their minds and the way they treat others. I am sure that the woman who has walked away from the beatings will not agree with you to stay around for more beatings until the beater may change their attitude.

Peace

Gerry

Mani
18 Apr 10, 12:08
Above all, I think it is good to put trust in the Dharma, and in the three jewels! http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/images/smilies/hands.gif

Esho
18 Apr 10, 17:22
I have always understood as a practising Buddhist that I should trust others without question. If I do not trust immediately I am making a judgement of that person and who am I to make judgements on any other human being.

Hello Gerry dear,

I feel you are showing commpasionate feelings toward others when you wrote about judgeing others. But even to trust others without question is quite a subtle judgement. As a personal opinion, what buddhism can bring you is to "see things as they are" neither absolutly good, nor absolutly bad. People is people and sometimes are reliable and sometimes are not.

http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/images/smilies/hands.gif

thundreams
19 Apr 10, 02:36
"see things as they are" neither absolutly good, nor absolutly bad. People is people and sometimes are reliable and sometimes are not.

http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/images/smilies/hands.gif

gerrymob
19 Apr 10, 07:16
from post #14

Kaarine Alejandra

I understand what you are saying but I cannot sit on the fence making decisions.

I cannot trust some and not others, I have to have positive thoughts all the time and even when the trust is broken I have to deal with the person in a positive way.

If I cannot, I cannot tell the world and myself that I am a practising Buddhist.

Peace

Gerry

frank
19 Apr 10, 12:16
I cannot trust some and not others, I have to have positive thoughts all the time

Why?
I don't mean this in an ugly manner Gerry but a very large part of Buddhism is about looking within.
I understand this to mean we ask ourselves "what's going on? why am l doing this" and so on.
So maybe Gerry there is some benefit to you to ask yourself such questions in terms of what you have posted and l high-lighted.

frank
19 Apr 10, 13:52
from post #13

And people?

Esho
19 Apr 10, 14:21
a very large part of Buddhism is about looking within.

Also a essencial aspect of it.

http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/images/smilies/hands.gif

sukitlek
19 Apr 10, 14:25
From Mangala Sutta — Protection (Khp 5)

I have heard that at one time the Blessed One was staying in Savatthi at Jeta's Grove, Anathapindika's monastery. Then a certain deva, in the far extreme of the night, her extreme radiance lighting up the entirety of Jeta's Grove, approached the Blessed One. On approaching, having bowed down to the Blessed One, she stood to one side. As she stood to one side, she addressed him with a verse.

Many devas and human beings
give thought to protection,
desiring well-being.
Tell, then, the highest protection.

[The Buddha:]
Not consorting with fools,
consorting with the wise,
paying homage to those worthy of homage:
This is the highest protection.

Living in a civilized land,
having made merit in the past,
directing oneself rightly:
This is the highest protection.

Broad knowledge, skill,
well-mastered discipline,
well-spoken words:
This is the highest protection.

Support for one's parents,
assistance to one's wife and children,
consistency in one's work:
This is the highest protection.

Giving, living in rectitude,
assistance to one's relatives,
deeds that are blameless:
This is the highest protection.

Avoiding, abstaining from evil;
refraining from intoxicants,
being heedful of the qualities of the mind:
This is the highest protection.

Respect, humility,
contentment, gratitude,
hearing the Dhamma on timely occasions:
This is the highest protection.

Patience, compliance,
seeing contemplatives,
discussing the Dhamma on timely occasions:
This is the highest protection.

Austerity, celibacy,
seeing the Noble Truths,
realizing Unbinding:
This is the highest protection.

A mind that, when touched
by the ways of the world,
is unshaken, sorrowless, dustless, secure:
This is the highest protection.

Everywhere undefeated
when acting in this way,
people go everywhere in well-being:
This is their highest protection.

http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/images/smilies/hands.gif

plwk
19 Apr 10, 15:07
Not consorting with fools, consorting with the wise...
And the issue of trust...hmmm... http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/images/smilies/grin.gif

gerrymob
19 Apr 10, 16:57
from post #17

The Buddah also said that I do not have to follow blindly everything he said. I cannot write people off at a whim.

Peace

Gerry

gerrymob
19 Apr 10, 17:04
from post #21

plwk

One has to consort with the fool to find out that he/she is a fool, once that is known one can move on.

I cannot read minds, Buddhism does not encourage people to read minds, can anyone on this board inform/tell/teach me how to know a fool without speaking with them.

Peace

Gerry

Aloka
19 Apr 10, 17:05
The Buddah also said that I do not have to follow blindly everything he said

Please give references and ]http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/img/smilies/hands.gif[/img]

frank
20 Apr 10, 12:37
The Buddah also said that I do not have to follow blindly everything he said. I cannot write people off at a whim

Gerry,you don't have to "write people off" what's needed is the ability to discriminate,(this is most probably a very un-PC term these days).
But if you look at the term without the blinkers of the spineless wimps who seem to be dictating terms these days,it means only that you chose who to be with.
Ask yourself would you rather associate with a thug or a Arahant?,(assuming you could find one)

frank
20 Apr 10, 12:41
can anyone on this board inform/tell/teach me how to know a fool without speaking with them.

Gerry you can watch a persons behaviour,you can see who that person associates with.
There does not have to be any ill-will in this consideration,just plain common-sense.

Esho
20 Apr 10, 13:48
from post #26

True frank,

One can get deluded by speech but never by behaviour.

http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/images/smilies/hands.gif

gerrymob
20 Apr 10, 20:40
from post #25

frank

Discriminating is making a judgement. I will not make judgements immediately on seeing a person.

Peace

Gerry

gerrymob
20 Apr 10, 20:44
from post #26

frank

Watch a persons behaviour, see who they consort with.

I am sorry I will not make judgements of people unless I get to know them.

Do I see a book cover on a shelf and go past it because it doesn't take my eye?

Maybe Buddah Gotama was capable of doing what you say, I am not Buddah Gotama.

Peace

Gerry

gerrymob
20 Apr 10, 20:48
from post #27

Kaarine Alejandra

I need the speech and behaviour before I make up my mind if I have a relationship with a person.

Even if I am not sure about the individual surely it is possible that the persons behaviour and speech can change with being with me or others who can teach them to change their ways.

Peace

Gerry

Esho
20 Apr 10, 21:52
from post #30

Yes of course Gerry dear.

Also I think that one thing is to judge a person and other is to know a person without judgements. The things we love and we like to do tell very much about who we are.

http://www.buddhismwithoutboundaries.com/images/smilies/hands.gif

frank
21 Apr 10, 11:49
Discriminating is making a judgement. I will not make judgements immediately on seeing a person.

I didn't sat to make a judgement immediately,but l repeat the question would you rather associate with a thug or a Arahant?,
l think your just a nicer person that l am.